You’re likely part of the 4.88 billion mobile phone users worldwide. Today, 2.52 billion more mobile connections exist than there are people worldwide making cell phones making the fastest-growing human-made technological phenomenon ever. So, what’s the problem with all of this wireless radiation besides the fact that the World Health Organization classifies RF (radio frequency) radiation from cell phones as a Group 2B carcinogen; possibly carcinogenic to humans? A 10-year study by the National Toxicology Program of mice and rats exposed to radiofrequency radiation from cell phones, found: DNA damage in some of the animal groups tested, children were the most vulnerable to cancer risk due to their skull thickness and developing brains and increased rates of cancer were found in male rats exposed to cell phone radiation.
In this episode, a former engineer and founder of SafeSleeve, Cary Subel, shares technology for EMF protection that is certified in an FCC laboratory. We leave you with some simple ways to reduce your radiation exposure and protect yourself and your loved ones (and a special discount code for listeners).
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Episode Links:
- SafeSleeve (EMF protection products)
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- FCC Accredited Lab Testing
- Cell Phones: Convenient Communication or Boiling Frog Effect?
Narrator
How would you like to improve your health and keep your family safe? You're listening to the healthy home hacks podcast where we firmly believe enjoying optimal health shouldn't be eluxury healthy home authorities and husband and wife team Ron and Lisa will help you create a home environment that will level up your health. It's time to hear from the experts. listen in on honest conversations and gain the best tips and advice. If you're ready to dive in and improve your well being and increase your energy, you're in the right place. All right, here are your hosts, Val biologists, authors, media darlings, vicarious vegans and avocado aficionados, Ron and Lisa Barris.
Ron Beres
Chances are, you have one, your partner has one. And even your children have them. Yes, even your not so tech savvy mom or dad and your social loving BFF. And while these devices offers a modern day conveniences, stylish colors and instant gratification, they also come with hidden hazards that many people are completely on aware of. Today, the current number of mobile phone users is a whopping 4.8 8 billion, which equates to over 62% of the people in the world who own a cell phone. In just two years, this number is expected to increase to 7.3 3 billion. So almost half of the planet owns a smartphone and two thirds with a mobile device.
Then, there's this enormous amount of time spent on these devices. Let me paint a picture. Since the cell phones inception in 1973. Mobile Device connections have surpassed the number of people in the world, making it the fastest growing human made technology phenomenon ever. In fact, the amount of mobile connections worldwide surpasses the current world population of 7.8 4 billion, meaning there are over 2.5 billion more mobile connections than there are people world wide. So what's the problem? For one according to a 10 year $25 million government study by the National toxicology program, which is the division of the National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences of mice and rats exposed to cell phone radiation. It determined the effects in rats and mice from exposure to radio frequency, which is RF radiation from cell phones, and found one DNA damage in some of the exposed animal groups to children were found to be the most vulnerable to cancer risk due to their skull thickness, and developing brains. Three increased rates of cancer and male rats exposed to cell phone radiation. And according to the toxicologist who designed the study, these same cells that became cancerous and rats are the same cells that are reported to turn into tumors and people in epidemiology studies of cell phone users. Now that you've heard the bad, here's the good news. There are things you can do right now to reduce your exposure to harmful radiation, including protecting yourself and your family. Someone who is here to shed light on this is our special guest, Carrie subo. Here he is a former engineer and co founder and CEO of safesleeve. Here he founded safesleeve. with the goal of educating the public about the harmful effects of electromagnetic radiation or EMR exposure, and providing the best possible solutions. he happens to believe in living a healthy and active lifestyle, which is no surprise, but Gary also plays the guitar Fun fact, and has an insatiable desire to learn and improve himself in all aspects of life. Together with his puppy and family. Carrie, welcome to the show. Yes, Carrie, welcome. So glad to have you. Thank you guys for having me. Very happy to be here. No, we're excited. Well, Carrie, we're gonna dive right in and ask you a series of questions. I'm curious electromagnetic radiation. EMR occurs in a wide range of frequencies spanning what's called the electromagnetic spectrum. But can you explain to our listeners, how cellphone radiation differs from x rays and other similar types of
Carey Subel
Absolutely. It's a common misconception. I mean, the scary thing is that, as you mentioned, Ron, it does fall on the same spectrum cell phone radiation and radiation emitted by laptop, your tablet, the laptop, the cell phone that might be in your hand right now or even on your lap. It does emit radiation that's on the same spectrum as the things that we know cause cancer, the X rays, the gamma rays, the ultraviolet rays, the differences, it is lower frequency. And there's kind of a threshold where it goes from ionizing radiation to non ionizing radiation. And typically, the radiation from your devices is non ionizing. However, a lot of studies, as you also mentioned in the intro, I've linked that type of radiation also to the harmful health effects. So same spectrum, lower frequencies, which I always thought was interesting, because you assume something with a lower frequency wouldn't be as harmful. But I know we're going to get into that and even what something called extremely low frequency means our elf. But in addition to the study that we mentioned at the top of the show, a study published in the world Journal of surgical oncology found an increased risk for brain tumors, mainly acoustic neuroma and malignant brain tumors in people who use cellular or cordless phones. So Carrie, what other kinds of studies have been done on this topic? So that's kind of the king study that you mentioned, however, the results have been replicated. And even before the study came out, we had seen similar effects. There have been studies on infertility, there have been studies on again harmful cancerous tumors, and many of them have shown a positive correlation between radiation, exposure to cell phone radiation, and different types of electronic electromagnetic radiation and these harmful health effects. And these have been done all over the world, Sweden, France, Switzerland, the US, Canada, and even Australia, and many, many other countries have done similar studies that have yielded similar results. Well, I know there's at least 34 peer reviewed studies, I believe, probably more right. Isn't there a lot more than that? Actually? Yeah. Yeah. And I think a lot of people, especially people listening, are thinking, Oh, you know, that's not true. This can't be right. If it was linked to these things, they wouldn't be for sale, we wouldn't be able to access them. I mean, they would be illegal, right? And I think there tends to be an ignorance is bliss sort of mentality when it comes to this radiation? Would you agree? Absolutely. I mean, the advent of technology came so hot and heavy. Before we looked around, everyone has a cell phone, everyone has a laptop, and a tablet, even in the conveniences of having these devices makes it so easy to just kind of turn the other cheek. Also, the other problem is that, although it's pretty intuitive, that these devices emit radiation, and we know that radiation is not a good thing to be exposed to, we can't feel it, we can't see it can't hear it. can't taste it, that's not a sensory experience whatsoever. You feel your legs heat up, and you think, okay, my laptop's emitting eat. And so it's just heat, however, that he could be caused by the radiation that's actually interacting with your electro magnetic system in your body and causing that heating reaction, kind of similar to how a microwave works, it actually vibrates the molecules to the point of a heating up and microwaves are on the exact same lower frequency spectrum has the type of radiation being emitted by your devices. That's a little food for thought, no pun intended. But
Lisa Beres
right, that's interesting. We have an RF detector. And we use it to show people, friends and family when they come over. We're so fun to hang out with. Carry for the party. We're just like, no game night, here, we're pulling out the RF analyzer, or the RF detector, and we'll show them like, hey, if you don't think your microwave is emitting radiation, listen, because this will actually like project a sound as the radiation which we know goes through balls that can penetrate anything.
Ron Beres
Well, that's exactly what Carrie's show was like the analyzer, you're on that segment. And I think it was San Diego as ABC or something like that. I'm not sure which segment it was, but people just don't believe until they see it. And it's up to him to hear it. And you can actually show them, this is what you're being exposed to, you don't even know it. And here's what you can do to protect yourself. Right, exactly. I thought he did a really good job in that segment, by the way.
Carey Subel
Thank you. I appreciate it. Yeah, it was our local Fox, john, they're awesome. But for anyone who feels like, if they can't feel it, they can't hear it, then it can't hurt them. I mean, just think about x rays. We know that x rays are harmful. And yet, when you go to the dentist, you don't feel the X ray. I mean, maybe you hear a little buzz, but you're still wearing a lead vest and for good reason. And that's just a snapshot. And often, I mean, people are going what, once twice a year to the dentist to get x rays, right? Yeah, we're still wearing a lead vest to protect our more vascular areas in the chest and stomach. Clearly, even though you can't hear you can't feel it.
Ron Beres
It's a mind right. It's especially I know we're gonna get into this too, but especially with kids as that one study the government study in the US determined you know, the children are so vulnerable because they
Lisa Beres
They're developing brains and skulls. And yet, because there isn't enough awareness around this topic, you don't go anywhere. You don't go to a restaurant without seeing kids on their tablets on their phone. It's become the babysitting device. And it's really unfortunate because I think we're the guinea pig generation when it comes to all of this, as it like you said, it just went full speed ahead. And all of a sudden, we're all immersed into this technology before really the studies have even caught up and we have these studies, but a lot of people aren't really aware of them. 100%, and you said it best We are the guinea pigs. And I think we don't need much more evidence, other than the fact that the one study that we have from the US government, that large scale study that you mentioned, is on rats and mice, and that did show increase instances of cancerous tumors. And yet the argument on one side is Well, yeah, but it's rats, but at the same time, yeah, that's right. So what if it's even worse for humans? Right? Yeah. Then you related that right. And you really test on rats, because it's very similar to what would happen in humans. We are seeing like these tumors and these issues. I guess we're just not hearing it's not being reported. Or maybe it's not being correlated enough. I don't know, Curie. I'm curious. So before you became Kerry, CEO of safe sleep, with the founder of safe sleep, what measures Do you take to protect yourself? I guess, before developing your own solution, and are those methods viable? The inception, the idea, I was still in high school, I just got my first laptop. And it was a big chunk of a laptop probably weighed four or five pounds or something. And I was showing it off to one of my friends. And he told me that I shouldn't use it on my lap because of the radiation. And I kind of said, No way. I mean, I'm 17 years old, I'm invincible, and definitely radiation from my laptop. Come on. That sounds crazy. But anyways, doubt is a neurologist, it did kind of hit home a little bit, I couldn't get that thought out of my mind. And as I went to college, I was trying to keep the laptop off my lap, between putting a pillow underneath my laptop, and even trying to put my case under my laptop. At the time, I had a cell phone, but it was just a lot less prevalent. I didn't feel like I was on it all the time like him now, although it was in my pocket, just trying to keep it off my lap. And obviously, yes, keeping the laptop off your lap is going to be the most effective, it's like practicing abstinence, it's going to be the most effective means of protecting yourself. However, a it's not very realistic, B, what we typically try to do is put something like I said a pillow, we tried to add some sort of distance and distance is good. But oftentimes what happens is the pillow or whatever you're putting underneath your laptop, it's actually blocking the airflow, which creates the laptop needs to work even harder, which emits more radiation. Okay, and I can show you with the meter test. Well, I can't show you now on the podcast, but I can show you at a later time. If you put the meter on the laptop, and you pull it away, probably about eight to 12 inches is usually the threshold where the levels drop off significantly. If I put anything between that laptop, and my body, or between the laptop and the meter, you're not going to see a reduction unless it's a very, very specifically formulated material, like what we use in our cases to block it. Even if you think that you're using your laptop on a tray, in an airplane you're using on the pulldown tray. That plastic and even if it were metal, in most cases will do absolutely nothing to block the radiation and just completely penetrates it. Lisa D earlier point, you know, you would think a lower frequency wouldn't be as harmful. In some ways it can be more harmful because it's more penetrating. Typically the lower frequencies of emf can penetrate just about anything, which is really shocking. I think people don't realize and go through buildings and walls and even something on the other side of the room can still if you're close enough, can still affect you. Exactly. And when it comes to the cell phone, I'm sure you can find 100 articles out there what you should do if you want to be safe. Use speakerphone, turn your phone on airplane mode, use a wired headset when available. And the list goes on and on. Try not to use Bluetooth devices. Again, those are all effective means of reducing your radiation exposure. But how realistic is it in today's age, you need to answer a phone call you're in public, you need to put it up to your ear. You don't always have headphones handy, you can just turn your cell phone on airplane mode. That's exactly why we found safesleeve the idea of not using my laptop on my lap like I said it's stuck with me. I also didn't want to just not use it as its intended as the laptop I wanted to come up with a solution that not only didn't hinder the usage of my device, the effectiveness of my device and its convenience, but actually enhanced it that's kind of been at the core of all of our product development. I love that when we first discovered you guys, I don't even know how through our business. Of course, I was really fascinated with your story. Can you take us back to when you're in college and how you kind of connected with your partner and how did you come up with the concept for not just cell phones but laptops and tablets too for safesleeve
Carey Subel
As I mentioned, I had that idea in my head of, I can't use this laptop on my lap, but at the same time I need to LA and I, my partner, les, we were both studying engineering at the time. A we're just very critical thinkers. We're always looking for a geeky, that's you. Yeah, you're definitely.
Yeah, we're definitely geeks, we're always looking for solutions, we don't just accept, this is how it is. And you know, that's how it's gonna be. Intuitively, for me, I always thought there's got to be some sort of shield that I can put between my laptop and my body just to shield that radiation the other direction, just shield it away from my body. And when I researched, there really wasn't much out there. Luckily, we had access at the time to material scientists in the engineering department, we had access to the manufacturing resources, we were taking supply chain courses, product development, I mean, everything we were studying, in one way or another, enabled us to develop this product. We started with the laptop case, because that seems to be the most pressing need in college. We're sitting in lectures with our laptop on our lap with pretty much no other option. And really, we're very green to this. We're in college. That was our first time even thinking of creating a product, let alone starting a business. And we didn't really start pursuing until our senior year. But all the while we were late starter Carrie.
Ron Beres
Yeah, my god
Lisa Beres
not till then. You guys at Berkeley, or
Carey Subel
we're at Cal Poly San Luis Obispo,
Lisa Beres
okay. Oh, yeah. Which is a great school for engineering.
Ron Beres
It's so funny way to confession by our written phrase during the show carried by our executive producers says he leaves his laptop on his lap all the time. And he has no shielding for it. Today's call for wake up for him. And everybody needs a solution quickly.
Carey Subel
Yeah. And maybe we can link to the meter test, because I know this is a podcast format. But I think once you see that you guys said it earlier, it really just becomes obvious that now you can see it. Now you can hear it, the amount of radiation that's being emitted,
Lisa Beres
you guys head to the show notes at random Lisa comm forward slash podcast. And we will put the link to that test video so you can see it what Gary's talking about. Okay, I didn't want to interrupt but
Ron Beres
Oh, good. That was a good tip. But you know, we were being a little light hearted there. But it is a serious issue. And many listeners, they're not aware that the World Health Organization has classified RF radio frequencies, right? emissions from cell phones, as a group to be carcinogen, possibly carcinogenic to humans. Are there government regulations or standards that are in place to protect users against this radiation hearing?
Carey Subel
The FCC in the US is our governing body when it comes to protection from this type of radiation. And there are regulations in place, there are certain levels, there's a threshold that can't be passed by electronic devices. There's a lot of scary things about this. Number one, those limits are based on studies that the FCC conducted 26 years ago. And they've continually refused to update those doesn't like the block cellphone or literally, were there. A brick cell phone, the brick? That's right, the brick, yeah, those studies were simulating a fully grown, I think 200 pound male. Obviously, our usage patterns have changed dramatically, the types of radiation have changed dramatically. The amount emitted has increased exponentially. I mean, think about the processing power in a cell phone now compared to one of those bricks, oh my
Lisa Beres
gosh, right. And every generation of wireless, whether it's 3g, 4g 5g that's adding to the plate, and then you have each phone that comes out is giving you more exposure to
Carey Subel
exactly, but let's just say that those limits were miraculously actually accurate and helpful, even though they're far outdated. The Chicago Tribune, I believe it was two years ago, they did an internal investigation. And they tested the emissions from Samsung and Apple, the iPhone and some of Samsung's leading devices. And they found because these companies, the manufacturers are actually self reporting to the FCC. And they found in some cases up to five times the levels emitted that the FCC regulates and what they had reported to the FCC. Oh, wow. Even if those limits are fair and safe, which we strongly believe they're not, and they need to be updated and revisited, they're still being exceeded most likely. On top of that, if you look in your iPhone settings, in general, about RF, it's buried in the legal section, I can tell you exactly how to get there. We can link to it. But essentially, it says that you're actually within the FCC limits, as long as your device isn't in direct contact with the body. And there's a little bit of separation. As soon as you put that cell phone on your head, which I mean, who speaks with the cell phone not directly up to their ear, who puts their laptop hovering just a little bit above their lap. The manufacturers are aware of it, they are exceeding the limits with normal usage. And the FCC limits are outdated and the combination is pretty frightening. Then when you add the fact that that FTP study that you mentioned, or the NTP study national talk ecology program, the results of that study. They didn't release them for a while it was a publicly funded study. And it actually ended up going to the California Superior Court, where they then determined that these results need to be released because this is a publicly funded study. But the millions and millions of dollars that the cellphone industry spent in combination of lobbyists and legal fees to try to squash these results is pretty frightening.
Lisa Beres
Yeah, it's always follow the money trail. And in fact, as you state on your own website, similar to the emergence of other consumer products, such as asbestosis, and cigarettes, tobacco, whose deadly effects weren't apparent until many years after their introduction, many of us finally becoming less confident in the government to adequately test products for health and safety prior to mass use in the marketplace. Why do you think the government hasn't done more about this?
Carey Subel
I think there's, as with anything with the government, there's a lot of red tape, there's a lot of hoops to jump through. And a lot of that is legal. And they're going up against the cell phone industry, as I mentioned that spending hundreds of millions on legal fees to try to get these results, these studies squashed. And a lot of the times it's on technicalities. Something wasn't done exactly by the book with the public funding, and we don't hear about it. Oftentimes, FCC, EPA, there's many government organizations that are led by ex industry heads. We all know, there's lobbyists involved as well. It's publicly documented. I think that's a big part of why we've seen this information suppressed, and we haven't seen much done about it. Going back to that national toxicology program report on the RAD study, the government gave their reasoning for initially not releasing the results, as they didn't want to cause widespread panic,
Lisa Beres
and rather have individual panic when something goes wrong.
Carey Subel
Exactly. That doesn't seem like a great reason to me to squash the results altogether. I understand what they're going for. I understand the intention, but I think the execution is harmful. Yeah, I know somebody a while ago had suggested warning labels, like we would find on any, say, pharmaceutical product or any product that, hey, when you use this product, these are the risks, you need to be made aware of that. Maybe that's what Dr. George Carlo was fighting for Ron, he wrote invisible hazards of the wireless age. Just that, hey, you know, informed consent, okay, you want to use the phone, at least you know that these are the potential hazards. But the scary part is no one's being made aware of any of that. I think that's a big part is just use at your own risk. But you should know what the risks are. Absolutely, the city of Berkeley actually had a law in place where at the point of sale of any cell phone products, they had to display a warning label. It didn't say that this could cause cancer, it didn't say that it may exceed FCC limits, it just said that, you need to refer to your and don't quote me exactly on what it said. But it was something along the lines of we recommend you refer to your manual or your settings when it comes to radiation exposure. Okay. And that actually stuck for a while it went through multiple levels of appeals. And that was still in place for a while until I believe it was maybe about a year ago, after again, just millions and millions of dollars pumped in legal expenses into fighting this, the cell phone industry was essentially able to squash that not making a mandate in the city of Berkeley. And I think they realize they saw the writing on the wall. And I still believe it's a matter of time before that becomes at least a step in the right direction. But that becomes the standard, just the amount of the levels of appeals that this survive, I think shows you that yes. Eventually they found a court that said we can't require this. But how many hoops they had to jump through how much they had to keep pushing to get this taken off, get this law removed, I think shows you that it's just a matter of time before this happens. But they saw the writing on the wall. They I mean, the cell phone industry that if the city of Berkeley has to require this, and this goes all the way up to the California Superior Court and beyond. Then who's to say that every other city doesn't need to require it, and it becomes a federal standard. That's why they put so many resources rushing it
Lisa Beres
just takes one city to kind of lead the way.
Ron Beres
Curious right now a specific absorption rate or the thermal radiation. It's calculated for each cell phone on the market today. But many scientists are concerned about the non thermal low frequency information carrying radio wave or IC rw. This is the actual frequency that carries voice data from cell phones to the cell tower and back again. How do your products work to protect against EMF radiation? And do they also protect against 5g radiation?
Carey Subel
Good question on our products block, we integrate a shielding material that's been tested in FCC accredited lab, an independent lab and we've measured frequencies that spin all the way from your just electronic Mission. So you're 50 and 60 hertz, that's any electronic device, whether it's your blow dryer, your laptop, or even light bulb, for example, will emit a certain level of radiation just from the electricity. We also test higher frequencies that span things like your data connection, your 4g, or 5g, and your cellular connection and reception. If you check out our lab testing on our website, safesleeve cases calm, we actually break down exactly which frequencies we test. And we mentioned why those frequencies are the most relevant. And when it comes to 5g 5g is rolled out in 95%. of 5g frequencies that you're going to see right now are between five and six gigahertz, I think it's an even lower frequency than five to six gigahertz because of your 5g emissions are going to be in that four to six, I want to say gigahertz range. And we actually have tested that range. And unbox 99.999%. And actually, what we saw in our results is as the frequency goes up, as I mentioned earlier, sometimes the lower frequency, the longer wavelengths is actually more penetrating. And that's the case with the RF frequency. And as the frequency goes up, our shielding material actually blocks even more of it. Oh, that's great. I 9.98 becomes 99.9999, that, wow,
Lisa Beres
to break that down, and you have a really cool chart that kind of compares you to other competitors, so to speak, you guys are really unique and that you block 99% of RF radio frequency radiation, which comes from Wi Fi. But then you also block Tell me if I'm getting these stats, right 92% of elf extremely low frequency radiation, which carry was just talking about and then we're gonna get into your product a little bit how it has a cover, and it's really cool. And that that wallet is kind of like a wallet cover for your phone. And then the wallet cover also has RFID protection for your credit cards and anything like that that's in there. And thermal right, your technology protects from thermal heat. We've had Oren Miller on our fellow building biologists, and if anybody wants to go back and listen to his podcasts on 5g, they're pretty amazing. But he really gets into this specifically where, and I'd love you to chime in on as curious when you said, Hey, the government did these tests on, you know, a 200 pound male? Did they only test thermal radiation? Because I thought that was one of the issues is they're really not. They're saying, Oh, yeah, this is safe in terms of thermal exposure, but not in terms of the wireless and the extremely low frequency radiation. Is that right?
Carey Subel
My understanding? Yes, they didn't segregate as much as how it should be done, you'd really like to segregate the different frequencies and separate that from thermal. And oftentimes, what you see is the thermal effect gets combined with the radiation exposure effect. And sometimes this can show worse effects. They determined that, for example, the heating effect could cause skin damage. Do we know that that skin damage is from the radiation from the electronics? Or do we think it maybe it's just from the heat, it definitely is important to separate? And that hasn't historically been done very well. Although there may be thermal effects that are independent of the radiation effect from just having a hot device on your body and sometimes in direct contact with your skin? Yeah, we do really want to isolate the radiation element from the heat.
Lisa Beres
Right? Yeah, I mean, that just seems like so basic. And I know there's a lot of snake oil type devices out there. And I have seen them, I have seen reputable people promoting them, hey, just stick this sticker on your phone, and you'll be safe. I know you're gonna be rolling your eyes as an engineer. Explain to listeners why that doesn't work?
Carey Subel
Well, it's pretty simple sticker doesn't do anything. Really nothing. And sometimes there's a hologram in there. And I think there have been snake oil products in the past that have tried to claim that the hologram can do everything from I don't know if you remember those bracelets from a while back. And I think I bought into this as well. But netic
Lisa Beres
the magnetic bracelets.
Carey Subel
Yeah, magnets, and even some of them just had literally a hologram sticker. And they did some tests that made you think that you became a lot stronger as soon as you put this.
Ron Beres
Yeah, producer was one of those.
Lisa Beres
I swear I think I bought one of those. No, I bought into a lot of that stuff. Oh,
Carey Subel
no, I absolutely did as well until I realized that the trick was in the test, not necessarily. you'll believe that something works. When the proofs in the pudding, you go to the mall card, and they do that little test and you feel a lot stronger, a lot more flexible, you have a lot more agility. Part of me is like I don't really care what it is. If it's a sticker or magnetic or whatever. Clearly, it works a little different in this case, because the effects need to be measured as how much of a reduction you're getting, which is something that can really only effectively be measured in In the lab, we use the meter to illustrate the reduction because kind of in an ideal setting where you're able to isolate just the radiation from your laptop or your cell phone, you know, there aren't ambient levels, and you're able to measure it at the right angle, the meter can be an effective means of showing you whether shielding material works or not. However, it's not a foolproof. If the meter test passes, it works. And if it doesn't, doesn't, this can really only be measured in a laboratory. I've yet to see lab results that are actually independent third party FCC accredited labs that have any sort of credibility that show that a hologram sticker or any sort of sticker for that matter, can reduce the radiation either emitted by the phone or that's absorbed into the body. If it does exist, I would love to see it, we'll be getting some dots, I would love to offer that product to our customers, that might be the best solution that's out there. But I think it's a little bit of a pipe dream, the method that we use is intuitive. It's the thought that I had when I was 17 years old, putting my laptop on my lap is that there's radiation coming out of my laptop, and it's going into my body, can I put a shield between my laptop and my body just to deflect it away? That's exactly how we decided to implement all of our shielding material into all of our different products. So there's always going to be a shield between your body and your device.
Lisa Beres
Yeah, I love that. And I was talking about the snake oil products, I had found one. Ironically, a reputable place was selling them. So I thought, Hmm, I trust these people. I went to the website, absolutely no lab test anywhere, no certification, nothing to say yes, that works. Except words that says our products work listeners, do your digging, if you're going to buy into a product, they better back it up with science. And with a certificate just like everything we talked about whether it's a green cleaner, it needs a certification, or what we're talking about today, which is so important. and carry on your site, you guys do a great job explaining this and how your product works. Because radiation has to get to your phone to get a connection, we can't get a connection. If we don't have that signal, the radiations there, it has to get there and then, but what we're really trying to do, like you said is put that barrier. And then can you kind of explain how your case how the phone, how you created a case that goes over the phone, in order to do this kind of give us a visual.
Carey Subel
Okay, as I mentioned, there's always gonna be a shield between the device and your body. For our phone case, the laptop case was a bit more intuitive. It's literally a pad that goes onto your laptop. And we made a case out of it functions as a case and also will collapse into a lab test that has our shielding material in it, the cell phone. This usually takes a bit of explaining and a little demonstration, I hope we do a good job on our website, do you want to check it out, but safesleeve cases it's safesleeve cases.com is today's Thank you. Essentially there is a front flap, probably everyone listening has seen that wallet style case, as Lisa's demonstrating it as a front flap that covers the screen of the device. And oftentimes that front flap will have credit card slots, but jars does as well. In our case, you actually want to fold that flap closed while you're talking. So you open the flap, you answer your call, you close it back over the screen. And you talk just like that. And that front flap has the shielding material in it which deflects the radiation away from your body so that signal can still enter and exit on the unshielded side which is away from your head. And our tablet cases were somewhat similar. There's also a front flap that folds beneath the tablet which turns it into a stand if you want to use it on your lab. Or you can fold it behind if you're using it you know if you're just holding it. And I already mentioned the laptop case how that works. But essentially it's just shielding the radiation away from your body.
Lisa Beres
right because at the end of the day, we are wanting to protect these vital organs. The goal here is we're creating a barrier between our organs our head and that area. So you've got to be strategic. But I love you guys have the little cutout in the back so the camera is still you know available. And obviously the speaker and microphone are open with this beautiful, beautifully designed product that you guys created so you can still use the phone. This kind of shows you why a sticker isn't going to do the same job I mean when you see and you think about it just from the basics. You can see that you're literally protecting the entire front of the phone. How could a sticker do that? How could a little tiny sticker do the same thing.
Ron Beres
It's more than just functional teams. It's actually a really well designed has a lot of different options with its UI. Everyone that we've shown your product to curious in love with it to say there's something for everybody with their. And you mentioned the credit cards. I don't know if this translated during the conversation but I thought that was so cool to hear about credit card debt from people scanning your cards you're walking by just even a little added bonus to that being shielded within your wallet slash cell phone case. I love that
Lisa Beres
RFID protection and the case and like we were saying all the beautiful color options you Guys have literally a solution for every phone, you have to make a lot of different variations. Oh my gosh, I'm sure you have a lot of SK use? Absolutely, yeah. We saw in a retail store. So we know that. But Carrie, do you think there's anything for the home? We talked about the wearable devices? Do you think there's anything? A device that you're aware of? I've seen some of these really expensive like home harmonizers that reduce the radiation? Have you heard of? Or are you familiar with anything like that?
Carey Subel
I think there may be are some products out there that can be effective at protecting the whole home. I personally have found one that I believe in. And the reason why is a I think it can't hurt. But I would definitely use it in addition to some sort of shielding device or preventative measures like keeping your devices as far away as possible using wired headsets. And the main reason why is Lisa, as you said, the signal does need to enter and exit your devices in order for them to work properly. When it comes to the harmonization devices. The story is that it kind of reconfigures the frequency into something that's less harmful to the body, but it still allows your devices to work. I haven't personally haven't been convinced by a product that I've seen that's able to do that effectively. For me, it's the big counterintuitive, I don't know how the frequency can be changed enough to be okay for your body, but still good enough to give you a signal that you can use your devices,
Lisa Beres
right. It's like a seesaw if you want strong signal, but then you don't want the strong radiation. So you got to kind of you guys, you just got to go out and get a safe sleeve case. If you're listening and you're a parent, this is essential, this is essential. You cannot have your child be spending so much screentime without protection. Okay, this is just the reality we live in today. That is your homework, my friends. And Carrie, thank you so much. This was really incredible. I hope you guys enjoyed today's show as much as we did. Don't forget to visit safe sleep cases calm to shop for cell phone, laptop and tablet protection that's certified in an FCC laboratory to protect you from thermal radiation and block 99% of RF and 92% of elf radiation. We'll have all the links in the show notes at Ron and Lisa comm forward slash podcasts.
Ron Beres
And we'd like to leave you with a few helpful tips and action steps you can take right away. In addition to using your safe sleep case to reduce your radiation exposure. Number one do not carry cell phones and bras are tucked in clothing, too. Don't carry cell phones in pant pockets. It goes without saying number three wireless devices an airplane mode with Bluetooth off when not actively using them for use your speakerphone or hollow cord the air tube headset with your cell phone. Five, use a corded landline phone whenever possible to minimize cell phone use. And finally, six minimize exposure to wireless devices by choosing wire technology, especially for children. And want to thank you for joining us. Until next week, we're gonna find out what the heck is going on in your home. Take care.
Narrator
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Narrator
How would you like to improve your health and keep your family safe? You're listening to the healthy home hacks podcast where we firmly believe enjoying optimal health shouldn't be eluxury healthy home authorities and husband and wife team Ron and Lisa will help you create a home environment that will level up your health. It's time to hear from the experts. listen in on honest conversations and gain the best tips and advice. If you're ready to dive in and improve your well being and increase your energy, you're in the right place. All right, here are your hosts, Val biologists, authors, media darlings, vicarious vegans and avocado aficionados, Ron and Lisa Barris.
Ron Beres
Chances are, you have one, your partner has one. And even your children have them. Yes, even your not so tech savvy mom or dad and your social loving BFF. And while these devices offers a modern day conveniences, stylish colors and instant gratification, they also come with hidden hazards that many people are completely on aware of. Today, the current number of mobile phone users is a whopping 4.8 8 billion, which equates to over 62% of the people in the world who own a cell phone. In just two years, this number is expected to increase to 7.3 3 billion. So almost half of the planet owns a smartphone and two thirds with a mobile device.
Then, there's this enormous amount of time spent on these devices. Let me paint a picture. Since the cell phones inception in 1973. Mobile Device connections have surpassed the number of people in the world, making it the fastest growing human made technology phenomenon ever. In fact, the amount of mobile connections worldwide surpasses the current world population of 7.8 4 billion, meaning there are over 2.5 billion more mobile connections than there are people world wide. So what's the problem? For one according to a 10 year $25 million government study by the National toxicology program, which is the division of the National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences of mice and rats exposed to cell phone radiation. It determined the effects in rats and mice from exposure to radio frequency, which is RF radiation from cell phones, and found one DNA damage in some of the exposed animal groups to children were found to be the most vulnerable to cancer risk due to their skull thickness, and developing brains. Three increased rates of cancer and male rats exposed to cell phone radiation. And according to the toxicologist who designed the study, these same cells that became cancerous and rats are the same cells that are reported to turn into tumors and people in epidemiology studies of cell phone users. Now that you've heard the bad, here's the good news. There are things you can do right now to reduce your exposure to harmful radiation, including protecting yourself and your family. Someone who is here to shed light on this is our special guest, Carrie subo. Here he is a former engineer and co founder and CEO of safesleeve. Here he founded safesleeve. with the goal of educating the public about the harmful effects of electromagnetic radiation or EMR exposure, and providing the best possible solutions. he happens to believe in living a healthy and active lifestyle, which is no surprise, but Gary also plays the guitar Fun fact, and has an insatiable desire to learn and improve himself in all aspects of life. Together with his puppy and family. Carrie, welcome to the show. Yes, Carrie, welcome. So glad to have you. Thank you guys for having me. Very happy to be here. No, we're excited. Well, Carrie, we're gonna dive right in and ask you a series of questions. I'm curious electromagnetic radiation. EMR occurs in a wide range of frequencies spanning what's called the electromagnetic spectrum. But can you explain to our listeners, how cellphone radiation differs from x rays and other similar types of
Carey Subel
Absolutely. It's a common misconception. I mean, the scary thing is that, as you mentioned, Ron, it does fall on the same spectrum cell phone radiation and radiation emitted by laptop, your tablet, the laptop, the cell phone that might be in your hand right now or even on your lap. It does emit radiation that's on the same spectrum as the things that we know cause cancer, the X rays, the gamma rays, the ultraviolet rays, the differences, it is lower frequency. And there's kind of a threshold where it goes from ionizing radiation to non ionizing radiation. And typically, the radiation from your devices is non ionizing. However, a lot of studies, as you also mentioned in the intro, I've linked that type of radiation also to the harmful health effects. So same spectrum, lower frequencies, which I always thought was interesting, because you assume something with a lower frequency wouldn't be as harmful. But I know we're going to get into that and even what something called extremely low frequency means our elf. But in addition to the study that we mentioned at the top of the show, a study published in the world Journal of surgical oncology found an increased risk for brain tumors, mainly acoustic neuroma and malignant brain tumors in people who use cellular or cordless phones. So Carrie, what other kinds of studies have been done on this topic? So that's kind of the king study that you mentioned, however, the results have been replicated. And even before the study came out, we had seen similar effects. There have been studies on infertility, there have been studies on again harmful cancerous tumors, and many of them have shown a positive correlation between radiation, exposure to cell phone radiation, and different types of electronic electromagnetic radiation and these harmful health effects. And these have been done all over the world, Sweden, France, Switzerland, the US, Canada, and even Australia, and many, many other countries have done similar studies that have yielded similar results. Well, I know there's at least 34 peer reviewed studies, I believe, probably more right. Isn't there a lot more than that? Actually? Yeah. Yeah. And I think a lot of people, especially people listening, are thinking, Oh, you know, that's not true. This can't be right. If it was linked to these things, they wouldn't be for sale, we wouldn't be able to access them. I mean, they would be illegal, right? And I think there tends to be an ignorance is bliss sort of mentality when it comes to this radiation? Would you agree? Absolutely. I mean, the advent of technology came so hot and heavy. Before we looked around, everyone has a cell phone, everyone has a laptop, and a tablet, even in the conveniences of having these devices makes it so easy to just kind of turn the other cheek. Also, the other problem is that, although it's pretty intuitive, that these devices emit radiation, and we know that radiation is not a good thing to be exposed to, we can't feel it, we can't see it can't hear it. can't taste it, that's not a sensory experience whatsoever. You feel your legs heat up, and you think, okay, my laptop's emitting eat. And so it's just heat, however, that he could be caused by the radiation that's actually interacting with your electro magnetic system in your body and causing that heating reaction, kind of similar to how a microwave works, it actually vibrates the molecules to the point of a heating up and microwaves are on the exact same lower frequency spectrum has the type of radiation being emitted by your devices. That's a little food for thought, no pun intended. But
Lisa Beres
right, that's interesting. We have an RF detector. And we use it to show people, friends and family when they come over. We're so fun to hang out with. Carry for the party. We're just like, no game night, here, we're pulling out the RF analyzer, or the RF detector, and we'll show them like, hey, if you don't think your microwave is emitting radiation, listen, because this will actually like project a sound as the radiation which we know goes through balls that can penetrate anything.
Ron Beres
Well, that's exactly what Carrie's show was like the analyzer, you're on that segment. And I think it was San Diego as ABC or something like that. I'm not sure which segment it was, but people just don't believe until they see it. And it's up to him to hear it. And you can actually show them, this is what you're being exposed to, you don't even know it. And here's what you can do to protect yourself. Right, exactly. I thought he did a really good job in that segment, by the way.
Carey Subel
Thank you. I appreciate it. Yeah, it was our local Fox, john, they're awesome. But for anyone who feels like, if they can't feel it, they can't hear it, then it can't hurt them. I mean, just think about x rays. We know that x rays are harmful. And yet, when you go to the dentist, you don't feel the X ray. I mean, maybe you hear a little buzz, but you're still wearing a lead vest and for good reason. And that's just a snapshot. And often, I mean, people are going what, once twice a year to the dentist to get x rays, right? Yeah, we're still wearing a lead vest to protect our more vascular areas in the chest and stomach. Clearly, even though you can't hear you can't feel it.
Ron Beres
It's a mind right. It's especially I know we're gonna get into this too, but especially with kids as that one study the government study in the US determined you know, the children are so vulnerable because they
Lisa Beres
They're developing brains and skulls. And yet, because there isn't enough awareness around this topic, you don't go anywhere. You don't go to a restaurant without seeing kids on their tablets on their phone. It's become the babysitting device. And it's really unfortunate because I think we're the guinea pig generation when it comes to all of this, as it like you said, it just went full speed ahead. And all of a sudden, we're all immersed into this technology before really the studies have even caught up and we have these studies, but a lot of people aren't really aware of them. 100%, and you said it best We are the guinea pigs. And I think we don't need much more evidence, other than the fact that the one study that we have from the US government, that large scale study that you mentioned, is on rats and mice, and that did show increase instances of cancerous tumors. And yet the argument on one side is Well, yeah, but it's rats, but at the same time, yeah, that's right. So what if it's even worse for humans? Right? Yeah. Then you related that right. And you really test on rats, because it's very similar to what would happen in humans. We are seeing like these tumors and these issues. I guess we're just not hearing it's not being reported. Or maybe it's not being correlated enough. I don't know, Curie. I'm curious. So before you became Kerry, CEO of safe sleep, with the founder of safe sleep, what measures Do you take to protect yourself? I guess, before developing your own solution, and are those methods viable? The inception, the idea, I was still in high school, I just got my first laptop. And it was a big chunk of a laptop probably weighed four or five pounds or something. And I was showing it off to one of my friends. And he told me that I shouldn't use it on my lap because of the radiation. And I kind of said, No way. I mean, I'm 17 years old, I'm invincible, and definitely radiation from my laptop. Come on. That sounds crazy. But anyways, doubt is a neurologist, it did kind of hit home a little bit, I couldn't get that thought out of my mind. And as I went to college, I was trying to keep the laptop off my lap, between putting a pillow underneath my laptop, and even trying to put my case under my laptop. At the time, I had a cell phone, but it was just a lot less prevalent. I didn't feel like I was on it all the time like him now, although it was in my pocket, just trying to keep it off my lap. And obviously, yes, keeping the laptop off your lap is going to be the most effective, it's like practicing abstinence, it's going to be the most effective means of protecting yourself. However, a it's not very realistic, B, what we typically try to do is put something like I said a pillow, we tried to add some sort of distance and distance is good. But oftentimes what happens is the pillow or whatever you're putting underneath your laptop, it's actually blocking the airflow, which creates the laptop needs to work even harder, which emits more radiation. Okay, and I can show you with the meter test. Well, I can't show you now on the podcast, but I can show you at a later time. If you put the meter on the laptop, and you pull it away, probably about eight to 12 inches is usually the threshold where the levels drop off significantly. If I put anything between that laptop, and my body, or between the laptop and the meter, you're not going to see a reduction unless it's a very, very specifically formulated material, like what we use in our cases to block it. Even if you think that you're using your laptop on a tray, in an airplane you're using on the pulldown tray. That plastic and even if it were metal, in most cases will do absolutely nothing to block the radiation and just completely penetrates it. Lisa D earlier point, you know, you would think a lower frequency wouldn't be as harmful. In some ways it can be more harmful because it's more penetrating. Typically the lower frequencies of emf can penetrate just about anything, which is really shocking. I think people don't realize and go through buildings and walls and even something on the other side of the room can still if you're close enough, can still affect you. Exactly. And when it comes to the cell phone, I'm sure you can find 100 articles out there what you should do if you want to be safe. Use speakerphone, turn your phone on airplane mode, use a wired headset when available. And the list goes on and on. Try not to use Bluetooth devices. Again, those are all effective means of reducing your radiation exposure. But how realistic is it in today's age, you need to answer a phone call you're in public, you need to put it up to your ear. You don't always have headphones handy, you can just turn your cell phone on airplane mode. That's exactly why we found safesleeve the idea of not using my laptop on my lap like I said it's stuck with me. I also didn't want to just not use it as its intended as the laptop I wanted to come up with a solution that not only didn't hinder the usage of my device, the effectiveness of my device and its convenience, but actually enhanced it that's kind of been at the core of all of our product development. I love that when we first discovered you guys, I don't even know how through our business. Of course, I was really fascinated with your story. Can you take us back to when you're in college and how you kind of connected with your partner and how did you come up with the concept for not just cell phones but laptops and tablets too for safesleeve
Carey Subel
As I mentioned, I had that idea in my head of, I can't use this laptop on my lap, but at the same time I need to LA and I, my partner, les, we were both studying engineering at the time. A we're just very critical thinkers. We're always looking for a geeky, that's you. Yeah, you're definitely.
Yeah, we're definitely geeks, we're always looking for solutions, we don't just accept, this is how it is. And you know, that's how it's gonna be. Intuitively, for me, I always thought there's got to be some sort of shield that I can put between my laptop and my body just to shield that radiation the other direction, just shield it away from my body. And when I researched, there really wasn't much out there. Luckily, we had access at the time to material scientists in the engineering department, we had access to the manufacturing resources, we were taking supply chain courses, product development, I mean, everything we were studying, in one way or another, enabled us to develop this product. We started with the laptop case, because that seems to be the most pressing need in college. We're sitting in lectures with our laptop on our lap with pretty much no other option. And really, we're very green to this. We're in college. That was our first time even thinking of creating a product, let alone starting a business. And we didn't really start pursuing until our senior year. But all the while we were late starter Carrie.
Ron Beres
Yeah, my god
Lisa Beres
not till then. You guys at Berkeley, or
Carey Subel
we're at Cal Poly San Luis Obispo,
Lisa Beres
okay. Oh, yeah. Which is a great school for engineering.
Ron Beres
It's so funny way to confession by our written phrase during the show carried by our executive producers says he leaves his laptop on his lap all the time. And he has no shielding for it. Today's call for wake up for him. And everybody needs a solution quickly.
Carey Subel
Yeah. And maybe we can link to the meter test, because I know this is a podcast format. But I think once you see that you guys said it earlier, it really just becomes obvious that now you can see it. Now you can hear it, the amount of radiation that's being emitted,
Lisa Beres
you guys head to the show notes at random Lisa comm forward slash podcast. And we will put the link to that test video so you can see it what Gary's talking about. Okay, I didn't want to interrupt but
Ron Beres
Oh, good. That was a good tip. But you know, we were being a little light hearted there. But it is a serious issue. And many listeners, they're not aware that the World Health Organization has classified RF radio frequencies, right? emissions from cell phones, as a group to be carcinogen, possibly carcinogenic to humans. Are there government regulations or standards that are in place to protect users against this radiation hearing?
Carey Subel
The FCC in the US is our governing body when it comes to protection from this type of radiation. And there are regulations in place, there are certain levels, there's a threshold that can't be passed by electronic devices. There's a lot of scary things about this. Number one, those limits are based on studies that the FCC conducted 26 years ago. And they've continually refused to update those doesn't like the block cellphone or literally, were there. A brick cell phone, the brick? That's right, the brick, yeah, those studies were simulating a fully grown, I think 200 pound male. Obviously, our usage patterns have changed dramatically, the types of radiation have changed dramatically. The amount emitted has increased exponentially. I mean, think about the processing power in a cell phone now compared to one of those bricks, oh my
Lisa Beres
gosh, right. And every generation of wireless, whether it's 3g, 4g 5g that's adding to the plate, and then you have each phone that comes out is giving you more exposure to
Carey Subel
exactly, but let's just say that those limits were miraculously actually accurate and helpful, even though they're far outdated. The Chicago Tribune, I believe it was two years ago, they did an internal investigation. And they tested the emissions from Samsung and Apple, the iPhone and some of Samsung's leading devices. And they found because these companies, the manufacturers are actually self reporting to the FCC. And they found in some cases up to five times the levels emitted that the FCC regulates and what they had reported to the FCC. Oh, wow. Even if those limits are fair and safe, which we strongly believe they're not, and they need to be updated and revisited, they're still being exceeded most likely. On top of that, if you look in your iPhone settings, in general, about RF, it's buried in the legal section, I can tell you exactly how to get there. We can link to it. But essentially, it says that you're actually within the FCC limits, as long as your device isn't in direct contact with the body. And there's a little bit of separation. As soon as you put that cell phone on your head, which I mean, who speaks with the cell phone not directly up to their ear, who puts their laptop hovering just a little bit above their lap. The manufacturers are aware of it, they are exceeding the limits with normal usage. And the FCC limits are outdated and the combination is pretty frightening. Then when you add the fact that that FTP study that you mentioned, or the NTP study national talk ecology program, the results of that study. They didn't release them for a while it was a publicly funded study. And it actually ended up going to the California Superior Court, where they then determined that these results need to be released because this is a publicly funded study. But the millions and millions of dollars that the cellphone industry spent in combination of lobbyists and legal fees to try to squash these results is pretty frightening.
Lisa Beres
Yeah, it's always follow the money trail. And in fact, as you state on your own website, similar to the emergence of other consumer products, such as asbestosis, and cigarettes, tobacco, whose deadly effects weren't apparent until many years after their introduction, many of us finally becoming less confident in the government to adequately test products for health and safety prior to mass use in the marketplace. Why do you think the government hasn't done more about this?
Carey Subel
I think there's, as with anything with the government, there's a lot of red tape, there's a lot of hoops to jump through. And a lot of that is legal. And they're going up against the cell phone industry, as I mentioned that spending hundreds of millions on legal fees to try to get these results, these studies squashed. And a lot of the times it's on technicalities. Something wasn't done exactly by the book with the public funding, and we don't hear about it. Oftentimes, FCC, EPA, there's many government organizations that are led by ex industry heads. We all know, there's lobbyists involved as well. It's publicly documented. I think that's a big part of why we've seen this information suppressed, and we haven't seen much done about it. Going back to that national toxicology program report on the RAD study, the government gave their reasoning for initially not releasing the results, as they didn't want to cause widespread panic,
Lisa Beres
and rather have individual panic when something goes wrong.
Carey Subel
Exactly. That doesn't seem like a great reason to me to squash the results altogether. I understand what they're going for. I understand the intention, but I think the execution is harmful. Yeah, I know somebody a while ago had suggested warning labels, like we would find on any, say, pharmaceutical product or any product that, hey, when you use this product, these are the risks, you need to be made aware of that. Maybe that's what Dr. George Carlo was fighting for Ron, he wrote invisible hazards of the wireless age. Just that, hey, you know, informed consent, okay, you want to use the phone, at least you know that these are the potential hazards. But the scary part is no one's being made aware of any of that. I think that's a big part is just use at your own risk. But you should know what the risks are. Absolutely, the city of Berkeley actually had a law in place where at the point of sale of any cell phone products, they had to display a warning label. It didn't say that this could cause cancer, it didn't say that it may exceed FCC limits, it just said that, you need to refer to your and don't quote me exactly on what it said. But it was something along the lines of we recommend you refer to your manual or your settings when it comes to radiation exposure. Okay. And that actually stuck for a while it went through multiple levels of appeals. And that was still in place for a while until I believe it was maybe about a year ago, after again, just millions and millions of dollars pumped in legal expenses into fighting this, the cell phone industry was essentially able to squash that not making a mandate in the city of Berkeley. And I think they realize they saw the writing on the wall. And I still believe it's a matter of time before that becomes at least a step in the right direction. But that becomes the standard, just the amount of the levels of appeals that this survive, I think shows you that yes. Eventually they found a court that said we can't require this. But how many hoops they had to jump through how much they had to keep pushing to get this taken off, get this law removed, I think shows you that it's just a matter of time before this happens. But they saw the writing on the wall. They I mean, the cell phone industry that if the city of Berkeley has to require this, and this goes all the way up to the California Superior Court and beyond. Then who's to say that every other city doesn't need to require it, and it becomes a federal standard. That's why they put so many resources rushing it
Lisa Beres
just takes one city to kind of lead the way.
Ron Beres
Curious right now a specific absorption rate or the thermal radiation. It's calculated for each cell phone on the market today. But many scientists are concerned about the non thermal low frequency information carrying radio wave or IC rw. This is the actual frequency that carries voice data from cell phones to the cell tower and back again. How do your products work to protect against EMF radiation? And do they also protect against 5g radiation?
Carey Subel
Good question on our products block, we integrate a shielding material that's been tested in FCC accredited lab, an independent lab and we've measured frequencies that spin all the way from your just electronic Mission. So you're 50 and 60 hertz, that's any electronic device, whether it's your blow dryer, your laptop, or even light bulb, for example, will emit a certain level of radiation just from the electricity. We also test higher frequencies that span things like your data connection, your 4g, or 5g, and your cellular connection and reception. If you check out our lab testing on our website, safesleeve cases calm, we actually break down exactly which frequencies we test. And we mentioned why those frequencies are the most relevant. And when it comes to 5g 5g is rolled out in 95%. of 5g frequencies that you're going to see right now are between five and six gigahertz, I think it's an even lower frequency than five to six gigahertz because of your 5g emissions are going to be in that four to six, I want to say gigahertz range. And we actually have tested that range. And unbox 99.999%. And actually, what we saw in our results is as the frequency goes up, as I mentioned earlier, sometimes the lower frequency, the longer wavelengths is actually more penetrating. And that's the case with the RF frequency. And as the frequency goes up, our shielding material actually blocks even more of it. Oh, that's great. I 9.98 becomes 99.9999, that, wow,
Lisa Beres
to break that down, and you have a really cool chart that kind of compares you to other competitors, so to speak, you guys are really unique and that you block 99% of RF radio frequency radiation, which comes from Wi Fi. But then you also block Tell me if I'm getting these stats, right 92% of elf extremely low frequency radiation, which carry was just talking about and then we're gonna get into your product a little bit how it has a cover, and it's really cool. And that that wallet is kind of like a wallet cover for your phone. And then the wallet cover also has RFID protection for your credit cards and anything like that that's in there. And thermal right, your technology protects from thermal heat. We've had Oren Miller on our fellow building biologists, and if anybody wants to go back and listen to his podcasts on 5g, they're pretty amazing. But he really gets into this specifically where, and I'd love you to chime in on as curious when you said, Hey, the government did these tests on, you know, a 200 pound male? Did they only test thermal radiation? Because I thought that was one of the issues is they're really not. They're saying, Oh, yeah, this is safe in terms of thermal exposure, but not in terms of the wireless and the extremely low frequency radiation. Is that right?
Carey Subel
My understanding? Yes, they didn't segregate as much as how it should be done, you'd really like to segregate the different frequencies and separate that from thermal. And oftentimes, what you see is the thermal effect gets combined with the radiation exposure effect. And sometimes this can show worse effects. They determined that, for example, the heating effect could cause skin damage. Do we know that that skin damage is from the radiation from the electronics? Or do we think it maybe it's just from the heat, it definitely is important to separate? And that hasn't historically been done very well. Although there may be thermal effects that are independent of the radiation effect from just having a hot device on your body and sometimes in direct contact with your skin? Yeah, we do really want to isolate the radiation element from the heat.
Lisa Beres
Right? Yeah, I mean, that just seems like so basic. And I know there's a lot of snake oil type devices out there. And I have seen them, I have seen reputable people promoting them, hey, just stick this sticker on your phone, and you'll be safe. I know you're gonna be rolling your eyes as an engineer. Explain to listeners why that doesn't work?
Carey Subel
Well, it's pretty simple sticker doesn't do anything. Really nothing. And sometimes there's a hologram in there. And I think there have been snake oil products in the past that have tried to claim that the hologram can do everything from I don't know if you remember those bracelets from a while back. And I think I bought into this as well. But netic
Lisa Beres
the magnetic bracelets.
Carey Subel
Yeah, magnets, and even some of them just had literally a hologram sticker. And they did some tests that made you think that you became a lot stronger as soon as you put this.
Ron Beres
Yeah, producer was one of those.
Lisa Beres
I swear I think I bought one of those. No, I bought into a lot of that stuff. Oh,
Carey Subel
no, I absolutely did as well until I realized that the trick was in the test, not necessarily. you'll believe that something works. When the proofs in the pudding, you go to the mall card, and they do that little test and you feel a lot stronger, a lot more flexible, you have a lot more agility. Part of me is like I don't really care what it is. If it's a sticker or magnetic or whatever. Clearly, it works a little different in this case, because the effects need to be measured as how much of a reduction you're getting, which is something that can really only effectively be measured in In the lab, we use the meter to illustrate the reduction because kind of in an ideal setting where you're able to isolate just the radiation from your laptop or your cell phone, you know, there aren't ambient levels, and you're able to measure it at the right angle, the meter can be an effective means of showing you whether shielding material works or not. However, it's not a foolproof. If the meter test passes, it works. And if it doesn't, doesn't, this can really only be measured in a laboratory. I've yet to see lab results that are actually independent third party FCC accredited labs that have any sort of credibility that show that a hologram sticker or any sort of sticker for that matter, can reduce the radiation either emitted by the phone or that's absorbed into the body. If it does exist, I would love to see it, we'll be getting some dots, I would love to offer that product to our customers, that might be the best solution that's out there. But I think it's a little bit of a pipe dream, the method that we use is intuitive. It's the thought that I had when I was 17 years old, putting my laptop on my lap is that there's radiation coming out of my laptop, and it's going into my body, can I put a shield between my laptop and my body just to deflect it away? That's exactly how we decided to implement all of our shielding material into all of our different products. So there's always going to be a shield between your body and your device.
Lisa Beres
Yeah, I love that. And I was talking about the snake oil products, I had found one. Ironically, a reputable place was selling them. So I thought, Hmm, I trust these people. I went to the website, absolutely no lab test anywhere, no certification, nothing to say yes, that works. Except words that says our products work listeners, do your digging, if you're going to buy into a product, they better back it up with science. And with a certificate just like everything we talked about whether it's a green cleaner, it needs a certification, or what we're talking about today, which is so important. and carry on your site, you guys do a great job explaining this and how your product works. Because radiation has to get to your phone to get a connection, we can't get a connection. If we don't have that signal, the radiations there, it has to get there and then, but what we're really trying to do, like you said is put that barrier. And then can you kind of explain how your case how the phone, how you created a case that goes over the phone, in order to do this kind of give us a visual.
Carey Subel
Okay, as I mentioned, there's always gonna be a shield between the device and your body. For our phone case, the laptop case was a bit more intuitive. It's literally a pad that goes onto your laptop. And we made a case out of it functions as a case and also will collapse into a lab test that has our shielding material in it, the cell phone. This usually takes a bit of explaining and a little demonstration, I hope we do a good job on our website, do you want to check it out, but safesleeve cases it's safesleeve cases.com is today's Thank you. Essentially there is a front flap, probably everyone listening has seen that wallet style case, as Lisa's demonstrating it as a front flap that covers the screen of the device. And oftentimes that front flap will have credit card slots, but jars does as well. In our case, you actually want to fold that flap closed while you're talking. So you open the flap, you answer your call, you close it back over the screen. And you talk just like that. And that front flap has the shielding material in it which deflects the radiation away from your body so that signal can still enter and exit on the unshielded side which is away from your head. And our tablet cases were somewhat similar. There's also a front flap that folds beneath the tablet which turns it into a stand if you want to use it on your lab. Or you can fold it behind if you're using it you know if you're just holding it. And I already mentioned the laptop case how that works. But essentially it's just shielding the radiation away from your body.
Lisa Beres
right because at the end of the day, we are wanting to protect these vital organs. The goal here is we're creating a barrier between our organs our head and that area. So you've got to be strategic. But I love you guys have the little cutout in the back so the camera is still you know available. And obviously the speaker and microphone are open with this beautiful, beautifully designed product that you guys created so you can still use the phone. This kind of shows you why a sticker isn't going to do the same job I mean when you see and you think about it just from the basics. You can see that you're literally protecting the entire front of the phone. How could a sticker do that? How could a little tiny sticker do the same thing.
Ron Beres
It's more than just functional teams. It's actually a really well designed has a lot of different options with its UI. Everyone that we've shown your product to curious in love with it to say there's something for everybody with their. And you mentioned the credit cards. I don't know if this translated during the conversation but I thought that was so cool to hear about credit card debt from people scanning your cards you're walking by just even a little added bonus to that being shielded within your wallet slash cell phone case. I love that
Lisa Beres
RFID protection and the case and like we were saying all the beautiful color options you Guys have literally a solution for every phone, you have to make a lot of different variations. Oh my gosh, I'm sure you have a lot of SK use? Absolutely, yeah. We saw in a retail store. So we know that. But Carrie, do you think there's anything for the home? We talked about the wearable devices? Do you think there's anything? A device that you're aware of? I've seen some of these really expensive like home harmonizers that reduce the radiation? Have you heard of? Or are you familiar with anything like that?
Carey Subel
I think there may be are some products out there that can be effective at protecting the whole home. I personally have found one that I believe in. And the reason why is a I think it can't hurt. But I would definitely use it in addition to some sort of shielding device or preventative measures like keeping your devices as far away as possible using wired headsets. And the main reason why is Lisa, as you said, the signal does need to enter and exit your devices in order for them to work properly. When it comes to the harmonization devices. The story is that it kind of reconfigures the frequency into something that's less harmful to the body, but it still allows your devices to work. I haven't personally haven't been convinced by a product that I've seen that's able to do that effectively. For me, it's the big counterintuitive, I don't know how the frequency can be changed enough to be okay for your body, but still good enough to give you a signal that you can use your devices,
Lisa Beres
right. It's like a seesaw if you want strong signal, but then you don't want the strong radiation. So you got to kind of you guys, you just got to go out and get a safe sleeve case. If you're listening and you're a parent, this is essential, this is essential. You cannot have your child be spending so much screentime without protection. Okay, this is just the reality we live in today. That is your homework, my friends. And Carrie, thank you so much. This was really incredible. I hope you guys enjoyed today's show as much as we did. Don't forget to visit safe sleep cases calm to shop for cell phone, laptop and tablet protection that's certified in an FCC laboratory to protect you from thermal radiation and block 99% of RF and 92% of elf radiation. We'll have all the links in the show notes at Ron and Lisa comm forward slash podcasts.
Ron Beres
And we'd like to leave you with a few helpful tips and action steps you can take right away. In addition to using your safe sleep case to reduce your radiation exposure. Number one do not carry cell phones and bras are tucked in clothing, too. Don't carry cell phones in pant pockets. It goes without saying number three wireless devices an airplane mode with Bluetooth off when not actively using them for use your speakerphone or hollow cord the air tube headset with your cell phone. Five, use a corded landline phone whenever possible to minimize cell phone use. And finally, six minimize exposure to wireless devices by choosing wire technology, especially for children. And want to thank you for joining us. Until next week, we're gonna find out what the heck is going on in your home. Take care.
Narrator
Thank you guys. This episode of the healthy home hacks podcast has ended. But be sure to subscribe for more healthy living strategies and tactics to help you create the healthy home you always dreamed of. And don't forget to rate and review so we can continue to bring you the best content. See you on the next episode.
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